What is life? - Printable Version +- CDIH (https://www.cdih.net/cdih) +-- Forum: General Discussion and Entertainment (https://www.cdih.net/cdih/forumdisplay.php?fid=4) +--- Forum: The Pit (https://www.cdih.net/cdih/forumdisplay.php?fid=9) +--- Thread: What is life? (/showthread.php?tid=10200) Pages:
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- Galt - 03-23-2005 Quote:The Jays Wrote:There are six major characteristics of life, and it looks like she can't do three of them; so, in my opinion, she's half way dead. She's been half way dead for years. She's been on fucking machines. I honestly have no clue what these magical six things are. I've been racking my brain for minutes here. Is this a biological thing, or more day to day activities? Are we talking about feeding yourself, washing yourself, walking, talking, breathing, and something else? Is this a known thing that I should Google or some Jaysism? That said the obscurity of what the hell he meant, got me thinking, where do you draw the line at what is life and when is it expendable? What rights do fetuses have to life? At what point does that right move from 100% the mother's to 100% the infant's? Conception, birth, or someplace in between? It's pretty tough to be logical unless you pick one of the two endpoints. Everything else is just arbitrary. What rights to convicts have to life? Do you you believe in capital punishment at all? (not from a "does it deter crime" standpoint, but from a "is it morally justifyable" standpoint) If you do believe in it, what's the line someone has to cross. Does have to be murder or would rapes, molestations, warrant capital punishment? Does it have to be a type of murder, more than one at a time, more than one time? What rights to animals have to life? Are there certain species that have a greater right to life than others? (unless you are a real wacko you will say yes) How does that get decided? Is it all mamals? Do they have to be a certain size, cuteness, or ability to be domesticated? Is the determination of an animal's right to life dependant upon what will be done with the carcass after it's killed? If I hack a pig to death on my front lawn and leave it there, there might be some animal cruelty/whatever citations, but if I have a roast, no so much. What rights to vegetables/burdens have to life? Who's decision is that to make? Does the person have to have explicitly said that they want to be offed for it to occur? Can loved ones make the decision for them, if the person hasn't made their opinion clear (and then what? majority rules of family members?) If the decision is to be made based on the logic of "the person is wasting money and it's pointless to keep them around", why can't an Insurance Company make that decision since their the ones that actually pay the costs? Edited By Galt on 1111561025 - The Jays - 03-23-2005 Quote:Theme #1 - Cells Quote:What is life? - Galt - 03-23-2005 and so which three of those can't she do? That is life of cells, and her cells are still living/dying/being created. - diceisgod - 03-23-2005 When I see pictures of terri schiavo sitting in her chair and just staring, it reminds me of me sitting here reading this messageboard. - Buttmunch - 03-23-2005 Yeah, but, she's no armymad. - diceisgod - 03-23-2005 i'd throw myself under a bus to save him - Goatweed - 03-23-2005 I really dont see what the problem is - how is it that her own family, flesh & blood, are not able to dictate what happens to her (live or die) ? It's her fuckin' family, let them deal with her. - MyTimelessSpirit - 03-23-2005 It should be here family to decide and no one else. I can understand taking her off of machines, other than a feeding tube as everyone needs food to survive, because if machines are the only thing keeping her alive than she is pretty much gone already. But if she is able to live and breath on her own with the feeding tube then the family will just have to deal with her living in the state she is in. She will die when she is ready. - Mad - 03-23-2005 Bring her a tray of food at all meal times, if she can feed herself, good. If not, oh well... - OAS - 03-23-2005 We put to much thought into what constitutes life. To me it is simple. Breathing, heartbeat, functioning brain that keeps the body doing what it needs to do. All of this on it's own. If you need an umbilical cord or a machine to make any of this work 100%, you are not alive. Pull the power to the machine and if you keep breathing your brain tells your body to function and your heart beats, you are alive. Cut the umbilical cord and the same thing. If you require food and water to sustain life as long as your brain allows your body to physically consume the food fine. A baby knows to naturally suck a nipple placed into it's mouth after it is born. We don't train the baby to learn how to suck the nipple, it comes naturally. Placing a tube down our throat to feed us is not natural. If the brain does not know how to consume the food, your dead. - Keyser Soze - 03-23-2005 what if one is injured and needs to be rehabilitated in order to perform these functions? - fbd - 03-23-2005 so a coma is dead? - OAS - 03-23-2005 Rehab is fine. Spoon feeding a person that has been injured until they heal still suggests they are alive. Tube feeding a responsive person still suggests they are alive. If they cant talk, hear or speak but they can blink once for yes or teice for no, they are alive. - Keyser Soze - 03-23-2005 then terry schiavo is not dead - OAS - 03-23-2005 She hasn't blinked in 15 years. Her parents say she responds, but doctors don't see it. - Keyser Soze - 03-23-2005 I guess you havent seen the videos. Shes quite responsive. I've seen them and futhermore... From New York Times, March 23... "This poor woman and this poor family are being used as a political football, and these guys will do anything to push the point that they think is so important, that they will invade this family's privacy," he said in an interview. He singled out Dr. Weldon, saying, "This is a guy who's lost track of who he is." Dr. Weldon defended himself, saying in an interview that his request to examine Ms. Schiavo grew out of a conversation one of his aides had with her husband's brother. But he also sounded conflicted and said he did not expect to get a response. "For me to examine her is a double-edged sword," Dr. Weldon said. "It's mixing politics and medicine. While it would be very helpful to me, I'm not sure how it would play out in a case like this." There are 12 medical doctors, 3 dentists, and 3 nurses in Congress, and most did not publicly invoke their medical experience during the Schiavo debate. Among them was Senator Tom Coburn, Republican of Oklahoma and a family practice doctor, who said in an interview, "I don't think you have to examine her. All you have to do is look at her on TV. Any doctor with any conscience can look at her and know that she does not have a terminal disease and know that she has some function." - OAS - 03-23-2005 I don't pay attention to the unsolicited opinions to news organizations. Videos, opinions etc are shown to us via the media to further an agenda. In the courts, under oath, testimony by doctors and experts treating her say she is in a vegitative state and she is non-responsive. There has not been one doctor familiar with her case, familiar being they examined her, tested her and physicaly were at her bedside, that feels she will recover or respond. Her parents under testimony say they believe she is responsive because they can feel it. She isn't blinking, squeezing their hands, smiling or anything else. She is unable to sustain continued life nor will she rehabilitate. She is dead with the exception of a heartbeat. - Keyser Soze - 03-23-2005 Are you implying they are using doctored videos? - OAS - 03-23-2005 What date was the video filmed? - MyTimelessSpirit - 03-23-2005 OAS Wrote:We put to much thought into what constitutes life. To me it is simple. Breathing, heartbeat, functioning brain that keeps the body doing what it needs to do. All of this on it's own. If you need an umbilical cord or a machine to make any of this work 100%, you are not alive. Pull the power to the machine and if you keep breathing your brain tells your body to function and your heart beats, you are alive. Cut the umbilical cord and the same thing. If you require food and water to sustain life as long as your brain allows your body to physically consume the food fine. A baby knows to naturally suck a nipple placed into it's mouth after it is born. We don't train the baby to learn how to suck the nipple, it comes naturally. Placing a tube down our throat to feed us is not natural. If the brain does not know how to consume the food, your dead.So what you are saying is that no one should ever be assisted with feeding themselves? That would mean a lot of the living now would have been dead long ago. What about a premature baby or a stroke patient that has their mind but not their body. Should we just sit there and watch them die without lifting a finger? I don't think so. |