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| Posted By | Discussion Topic: US isolationism..mmm nice. | ||||
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| WoRMFACE | posted on 07-23-2001 @ 3:33 PM |    | |||
| O&A Board Regular Registered: Oct. 00  | Global Warming Deal Leaves U.S. Isolated By Matt Daily Reuters BONN, Germany (July 23) - Ministers from nearly 200 countries clinched a historic deal Monday that should force most rich industrial nations to curb the air pollution blamed for global warming, but left the United States isolated. An all-night bargaining marathon in Bonn saw European Union ministers finally break a deadlock with Japan over how the 1997 Kyoto Protocol on cutting greenhouse gas emissions would work in practice, paving the way for the treaty to come into force. Another failure, after the collapse of a summit at The Hague in November, could have killed it off for good following President Bush's withdrawal from the pact in March. ''It's a brilliant day for the environment,'' a weary but elated Michael Meacher, the British environment minister, told Reuters. ''It's a huge leap to have achieved a result on this very complex international negotiation. It's a huge relief.'' Environmentalists voiced some disappointment at what they called loopholes in the deal. Greenpeace dubbed it ''Kyoto-Lite.'' But they said any accord, which made a start on curbing dangerous warming of the Earth's climate and the threat of rising sea levels due to melting ice, was better than nothing. Amid bleary smiles and multiple standing ovations for conference chairman Jan Pronk, the Dutch environment minister, there was irritation that Bush had rejected any deal in advance, saying Kyoto's mandatory emissions would hurt the U.S. economy. ''One country not playing the game is one too many,'' said the EU's chief negotiator, Belgian Energy Minister Olivier Deleuze. U.S. STANDS BY REJECTION Bush endorsed a general commitment to reduce greenhouse gas emissions at a weekend summit in Genoa of the Group of Eight (G8) industrial powers but insisted Kyoto was ''fatally flawed.'' That had left the EU's hopes of rallying a critical mass of the remaining industrial nations behind the pact dependent on getting Japan on board. Tokyo's reservations on technical issues and its desire to avoid leaving its U.S. ally isolated kept the result of the negotiations in doubt to the very last moment. In the end, not one of the 180 or so states present voiced objections to the final compromise, not even the United States -- though Washington repeated that it will not ratify the pact. Only the 30-odd most developed nations would, if they ratify the treaty, have to cut emissions and their support was the key factor in meeting criteria for the deal as a whole to survive. Some delegates hailed a new, global diplomatic elan from the 15-nation EU, while others saw a triumph for United Nations ''multilateralism'' over the ''unilateralism'' of the United States and the riot-hit ''rich man's club'' of the G8 in Italy. ''It shows that George Bush is totally isolated in the climate debate,'' said Greenpeace climate activist Bill Hare. Bush's representative in Bonn, Undersecretary of State Paula Dobriansky, told delegates: ''Although the United States does not intend to ratify that agreement we have not tried to stop others from moving ahead as long as U.S. interests are not threatened.'' Some observers in the hall heckled her remarks, in a rare interruption of the festive atmosphere. In a conciliatory gesture, Japanese Prime Minister Junichiro Koizumi said in Tokyo his government would ''continue maximum efforts'' toward ''an agreement inclusive of the United States.'' Canada, another U.S. ally on environmental issues which only belatedly swung behind Monday's deal, also said it hoped to see a promised new climate policy from Bush ''converging'' on Kyoto. DOWN TO THE WIRE Four years of negotiation had often pitched the EU, with its desire for tough targets on cutting emissions, against the likes of Japan, Canada and Russia who wanted more flexible mechanisms. After the failure at The Hague, those disputes boiled down to four tense days in Bonn. When Pronk put forward a take-it-or-leave-it compromise deal, immediately backed by the EU, ministers began a 24-hour race to break Japanese-European deadlock on one key issue -- how punitively the targets would be enforced. ''We felt we could not fail twice,'' Pronk said. ''Citizens, the electorate, people did expect us to reach a result.'' As dawn came up over the Rhine and fears nagged that delay could wreck the entire process, the EU found room to give ground, dropping the word ''legally'' from descriptions of how binding the hitting of emissions targets would be on countries. The ministers left haggling over the small print to civil servants spending the rest of the week in the former West German capital. EU officials insisted targets would still be binding. Spontaneous applause rang out in the hotel conference room where fatigued ministers had bargained throughout the night. ''We have rescued the Kyoto protocol,'' said EU Environment Commissioner Margot Wallstrom. ''We can go home and look our children in the eye and feel proud of what we have done.'' Not to be outdone in superlatives, New Zealand delegate Peter Hodgson said: ''We have delivered probably the most comprehensive and difficult agreement in human history.'' Forested nations like Canada, Russia and Japan won concessions from the EU to be able to offset carbon-absorbing forests against targets for cutting carbon dioxide emissions. Disappointed environmentalists say that means the cut is only about a third of the original goal of reducing industrial countries' greenhouse gas output to 5.2 percent below 1990 levels by 2012. But it was better than nothing. Said Jennifer Morgan of environment group WWF's climate change campaign: ''This first small step is a giant leap for humanity and for the future of our planet.''  | ||||
| weinie | posted on 07-23-2001 @ 3:44 PM | | |||
| Psychopath Registered: Oct. 00 | hey beavis, words suck. huh huh ummmmm huh. | ||||
| Arpikarhu Harmless Teddy I wish Maynard was still posting here so I could implant my head up his ass. Needle dick, bear salesman. I think I'm a revolutionary. Actually, I'm a one trick pony. I enjoy C&BT | posted on 07-23-2001 @ 3:44 PM | | |||
| O&A Board Regular Registered: Apr. 01 | what did you expect. our president is deep in the pockets of corporate america. he is bought and delivered. they pull his strings as they wish and environmental laws cut into thier profit margin. screw the future and the safety of our planet, they need money now! Arpi Karhu Kauppias Forever!!! graduted by CRXGIRL AIM- Arpikarhu  | ||||
| JohnSlack | posted on 07-23-2001 @ 3:58 PM | | |||
| Psychopath Registered: May. 01 | There is nothing like some good ol' junk science to just warm your heart. Any geologist worth his shit will tell you that global warming is bogus. The hippie 'scientists' are basing this theory on less then 100 years of temperature data out of the millions of years of the earths existance...its great to stunt the world economy because of some imaginary problem...and people wonder what is the problem in california - power demand has gone up 60% in the past ten years and no supply (read:powerplants) have been added because hippies told us it was bad. | ||||
| adolescentmasturbator | posted on 07-23-2001 @ 4:49 PM | | |||
| O&A Board Regular Registered: Jan. 01 | Regardless of wheter globabl warming is proven you cannot dispute that the air we breathe is extrememely unhealthy.  Resident Board Socialist Email me here IM me at stickysituation2 or pinkorag Webmaster of the Undergound Unofficial I Hate WhackBagKid Message Board I currently have brought Syndicate into the International | ||||
| Spork | posted on 07-23-2001 @ 6:02 PM | | |||
| Psychopath Registered: Jun. 01 | The air we breathe is healthier than it was 30 years ago and CERTAINLY a HELLUVA lot better than the shit air they breate in Europe. Face it, the Kyoto treaty is a HUGE SCAM by those wacky Europeans to screw over the U.S. economically. Just like the EU rejected the merger of GE and Honeywell to protect their own companies' asses not their consumers. People forget that in the 1970's people were predicting the coming of another ice age. John Stossle did a great piece for ABC News called "Tampering with Nature." Hopefully they will replay it some time. Another great book is "Trashing the Planet" by former (and now deceased) governor of Washington State Dixie Lee Ray. The environment is HEALTHIER THAN EVER! We live longer, we live better than we ever have before. Anyone who wishes to deny that is living in a fantasy world. If this is isolationism, I'm loving it, but I'm glad that the President AND Congress (the senate rejected Kyoto like 97-0) are not bowing to the Euro-trash interests who want to sink OUR economy!  Graduated and Rooned by Rone on 6/16/01 | ||||
| adolescentmasturbator | posted on 07-23-2001 @ 6:22 PM | | |||
| O&A Board Regular Registered: Jan. 01 | quote: BULLSHIT. I moved to NYC and within a a year or two I had started developing ashtma. I had severe coughing and internal problems. Guess what happened when I moved out of the city? I got healthier so fast. Personally who gives a shit if mr. billionaire tycoon can't buy another 2 houses. I'm more concerned over people's health and conditions. quote: Yeah that's great while they're at it they should merge with AOL Time Warner. Resident Board Socialist Email me here IM me at stickysituation2 or pinkorag Webmaster of the Undergound Unofficial I Hate WhackBagKid Message Board I currently have brought Syndicate into the International | ||||
| DannyNoonan | posted on 07-23-2001 @ 6:55 PM | | |||
| Psychopath Registered: Apr. 01 | quote: Me too. So, I moved. I once asked a college professor with her docterate in Theology, during a heated debate, if she thought the U.S. would ever suffer a decline in it's standard of living in order to make living conditions on the planet better. Her answer was, "No." I hate entrenched thinking... the air CAN NOT be getting any better. Sorry, it's real. | ||||
| Doc Smith I Love Anthony Zinni | posted on 07-23-2001 @ 7:03 PM | | |||
| O&A Board Regular Registered: Sep. 00 | OK...what happens if they don't meet their goal, the treaty fairy comes by and slaps them all on the wrist? Fossil fuels are cheap, even when they are expensive, they are still WAY cheaper than other energy. It is so much easier to dig stuff out of the gorund then come up with new sources of energy. Until it becomes economically beneficial to stop polluting, we won't. Simple It might suck, but that's the way the world works, deal with it And by the way, the air is much healthier now than it was 50 years ago, antecdotal evidence is wrong. Read stories about living in early 1900's in London, and you'll be thankful that factories have scrubbers for their smokestacks and cars have catalytic converters now  I can levitate birds. No one cares. | ||||
| adolescentmasturbator | posted on 07-23-2001 @ 7:10 PM | | |||
| O&A Board Regular Registered: Jan. 01 | Actually I do say there has been progress but we can't just stop. Oh I would assume if the treaty was not fufilled economic sanctions would be applied. We should keep pushing because we can't settle on better than before because people still get sick. BTW the London problem was because of the deadly mixture of smoke and fog called smog. Resident Board Socialist Email me here IM me at stickysituation2 or pinkorag Webmaster of the Undergound Unofficial I Hate WhackBagKid Message Board I currently have brought Syndicate into the International | ||||
| Romeo Manson | posted on 07-23-2001 @ 7:20 PM | | |||
| Psychopath Registered: Sep. 00 | Who really cares? We'll all be dead in 100 years. Burning oil was an environmental plus. It replaced that nasty coal. Cars were an environmental plus. No more horse shit in the street. Something will come along that is better than what we have now, but it will have it's problems too. Get used to it people. Nothing is perfect. | ||||
| The Painter 1/2 a bottle of Jack Daniels... it's a cure-all | posted on 07-23-2001 @ 7:29 PM | | |||
| O&A Board Regular Registered: Sep. 00 | Romeo. Those are truly words of wisdom. | ||||
| adolescentmasturbator | posted on 07-23-2001 @ 7:34 PM | | |||
| O&A Board Regular Registered: Jan. 01 | quote: What about your grandchildren that will have to pay for it severely. Resident Board Socialist Email me here IM me at stickysituation2 or pinkorag Webmaster of the Undergound Unofficial I Hate WhackBagKid Message Board I currently have brought Syndicate into the International | ||||
Nay. We are but men. ROCK. The man with the plan. | posted on 07-23-2001 @ 8:29 PM | | |||
| O&A Board Regular Registered: Oct. 00 | quote: Screw over the U.S. economically? Hey, we're the pussy country that's bitching about $2.00 a gallon for gas - Europe pays $4.00 a gallon. Did you think they drive the tiny shit cars cause they're POOR? No, it's cause they don't want to GET poor by paying so fucking much for gas... And hey AM - gotta grow a nice healthy immune system, bud. :) Haven't you ever heard that George Carlin bit? "Know why I have a nice strong immune system? Cause I SWAM IN RAW SEWAGE."  Me droogies: None. Syndra has graduated and will one day take on droogs of her own. Two positions available. Come and get one in the yarbles.... if you have any yarbles. | ||||
| o&aswallow | posted on 07-23-2001 @ 8:46 PM | | |||
| O&A Board Regular Registered: Jan. 01 | I have read both sides of the global warming argument. And although all would agree that any reduction in pollution is a great effort, the argument that global warming should be the driving force is weak. Scientists have proven numerous heating/cooling cycles of the planet over time and it is just nature’s cyclical process. As much as I despise Dubya, I feel he was right in this matter. This great pact has no teeth and will be unenforceable. Greenpeace will be the watchdog and nobody listens to them anyway. And the air and rivers are significantly cleaner today then they were in the early 70's. We are learning, but we can't sacrifice everything at the cries of a few. AM, sorry, you would have gotten Asthma even if you moved to Aspen Colorado. It's in your genes.  o&aswallow Recognized His Destiny Early. Too Many Hotties, Not Enough Horny Goat Weed Now accepting foster children applications. Cash only, no checks. Email at onaswallow@opieanthony.com Frat Guy has rented one of the foster bedrooms as of 7/21. Yes ladies, another college boy is in town for you to ravage. It at first you don't succeed, keep on sucking till you do suck seed. - Curly Howard. Pennsylvania resident, but original NYC listener. This message was edited by o&aswallow on 7-23-01 @ 9:01 PM | ||||
| IAmMighty | posted on 07-23-2001 @ 8:54 PM | | |||
| Psychopath Registered: Sep. 00 | quote: Actually a big reason they drive those tiny shit cars is because anything bigger won't fit on the roads. But there is a different mentality about driving there due to gas prices. When I was recently in Ireland if you were going someplace within several miles, you walked. Here I see lazy fucks drive three fucking blocks to the store for one box of Twinkies.  "Stared at the Mendi Gossamer for too long!" | ||||
| adolescentmasturbator | posted on 07-23-2001 @ 9:06 PM | | |||
| O&A Board Regular Registered: Jan. 01 | quote: But then how come it went away when i left ny? Resident Board Socialist Email me here IM me at stickysituation2 or pinkorag Webmaster of the Undergound Unofficial I Hate WhackBagKid Message Board I currently have brought Syndicate into the International | ||||
| Filzy Stand up straight Stomach in Shoulders back SOUND OFF!!! | posted on 07-23-2001 @ 9:16 PM | | |||
| O&A Board Regular Registered: Sep. 00 | Damn... This thread is spiraling downward faster than ICBM. I bike everywhere I go, unless It takes more than 2 hours to get there by bike, That's when I use money for a train.  I'm not dead yet, sorry to roon your hopes! Two, TWO sucessful graduates: whichwaymediumorrare AND Short Hills Mall | ||||
| IkeaBoy P.L.F. Portugese Liberation Front- Liberating Status' everywhere from the Tyranny of Portugal I will die a traitor's death | posted on 07-23-2001 @ 9:22 PM | | |||
| O&A Board Veteran Registered: Sep. 00 | The problem though is that eventually fossil fuels will run out and we need to start thinking of ways to remedy this problem. Because the oil companies paid for the Bush administration, Bush is supporting the oil companies by not exactly looking for new resources of energy, stuff that can be replenishable. And, until the oil companies can find some way to profit off of the R&D of newer energys, we'll be stuck relying on oil. ANOTHER problem I have. People complain about the gas crisis, running out of gas, high gas prices, etc. but who else has been driving down a single road and pass 5, 6 gas stations one next to another. Sometimes the same company, sometimes not but in less than half a mile you see 5, 6 gas stations. Now maybe it's just me but maybe if we cut down teh amount of gas stations there are we'd be preserving the oil a bit better. As for what I drive (at laest until college when I won't have a car), I drive a mid-80s Toyota. Why? Because I hate big cars, I hate SUVs, and it takes gas pretty well. SO my point is this - I like smaller cars more than big ones. The narrator in Fight Club is the man we will be, Patrick Bateman in American Psycho is the man we want to be Eliza Dushku- Hotter Than Britney | ||||
Displaying 1-19 of 19 messages in this thread. |